From lucio at lambrate.inaf.it Sun Jan 1 12:00:24 2023 From: lucio at lambrate.inaf.it (Lucio Chiappetti) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] incoming collections (and not) Message-ID: In my .pinerc I have defined a list of incoming folders, and a number of folder collections. Most of these point to LOCAL folders or directories, with just three exceptions: - in the incoming folders I have two external sites Gsuite {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=...} RCM {pop.retecivica.milano.it/service=pop3/user=...} - in the normal collections I have one "All Gsuite" {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=...}[[Gmail]]/[] - the first is checked SELDOM, it is the inbox on Gsuite which is copied to inbox by fetchmai, every 5 min via crontab. I check it ONLY if I don't want or can't wait 5 min (e.g. site enabling) - the second is also is checked SELDOM, it is the inbox on another provider, copied to inbox by fetchmai 3-4 times in a day - the third is the entire Gsuite repository other than inbox. De facto it contains only Spam and Bin, which I empty about once per day. Of course there is nothing strange that entering those folders have to type a password. The curious thing is that when, after having just started alpine, I type L to go the collection list screen (usually to navigate to other local collections) This asks the Gsuite password (but not the RCM password). Is this an IMAP vs POP issue, or a Gmail vs others ? Is it possible to defer password asking only to when one of the external folders is accessed explicitly ? -- Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Corti 12 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ A middle rank researcher at end career is not rich but is in the top 5% of the Italian income tax taxpayers. Does it not sound strange ? From andrew at aitchison.me.uk Sun Jan 1 13:47:23 2023 From: andrew at aitchison.me.uk (Andrew C Aitchison) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] incoming collections (and not) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Jan 2023, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > In my .pinerc I have defined a list of incoming folders, and a number of > folder collections. Most of these point to LOCAL folders or directories, > with just three exceptions: > > - in the incoming folders I have two external sites > Gsuite {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=...} > RCM {pop.retecivica.milano.it/service=pop3/user=...} > > - in the normal collections I have one > "All Gsuite" {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=...}[[Gmail]]/[] > > - the first is checked SELDOM, it is the inbox on Gsuite which is > copied to inbox by fetchmail, every 5 min via crontab. I check it > ONLY if I don't want or can't wait 5 min (e.g. site enabling) You may be able to run fetchmail as a daemon using the imap idle command which will allow gmail to alert fetchmail that you have new messages, so no waiting five minutes. This does require a long-running connection to gmail but you don't need to set up a TLS link every five minutes. This works well with my provider but I haven't tried it with Gmail as I just get them to forward my mail ... > The curious thing is that when, after having just started alpine, I type L > to go the collection list screen (usually to navigate to other local > collections) > > This asks the Gsuite password (but not the RCM password). > > Is this an IMAP vs POP issue, or a Gmail vs others ? ... or may be a first (or last) in the list thing ? > Is it possible to defer password asking only to when one of the external > folders is accessed explicitly ? -- Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK andrew@aitchison.me.uk From robin.listas at telefonica.net Sun Jan 1 14:01:15 2023 From: robin.listas at telefonica.net (Carlos E. R.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] incoming collections (and not) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0c0e8938-8521-0e8a-d2f3-d330a7c4205f@telefonica.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 El 2023-01-01 a las 21:47 -0000, Andrew C Aitchison escribi?: > On Sun, 1 Jan 2023, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > >> In my .pinerc I have defined a list of incoming folders, and a number of >> folder collections. Most of these point to LOCAL folders or directories, >> with just three exceptions: >> >> - in the incoming folders I have two external sites >> Gsuite {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=...} >> RCM {pop.retecivica.milano.it/service=pop3/user=...} >> >> - in the normal collections I have one >> "All Gsuite" {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=...}[[Gmail]]/[] >> >> - the first is checked SELDOM, it is the inbox on Gsuite which is >> copied to inbox by fetchmail, every 5 min via crontab. I check it >> ONLY if I don't want or can't wait 5 min (e.g. site enabling) I use "imap Ggl L" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=...@gmail.com}INBOX, with an application password. Certificates work :-) >> Is it possible to defer password asking only to when one of the external >> folders is accessed explicitly ? > > > You may be able to run fetchmail as a daemon using the imap idle command > which will allow gmail to alert fetchmail that you have new messages, > so no waiting five minutes. This does require a long-running connection to > gmail but you don't need to set up a TLS link every five minutes. > > This works well with my provider but I haven't tried it with Gmail > as I just get them to forward my mail ... I understand that in this mode fetchmail can only do one account. >> The curious thing is that when, after having just started alpine, I type L >> to go the collection list screen (usually to navigate to other local >> collections) >> >> This asks the Gsuite password (but not the RCM password). >> >> Is this an IMAP vs POP issue, or a Gmail vs others ? > > ... or may be a first (or last) in the list thing ? How about using a master password instead? - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. (from openSUSE 15.4 x86_64 at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHoEARECADoWIQQZEb51mJKK1KpcU/W1MxgcbY1H1QUCY7ICqxwccm9iaW4ubGlz dGFzQHRlbGVmb25pY2EubmV0AAoJELUzGBxtjUfVxIcAnjZ+o2SJpA0DBCzSdNze xMVYGSA/AJ4n6iuBe77q5mh8DnoMbejRVrv26w== =Il+p -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From andrew at aitchison.me.uk Sun Jan 1 14:43:25 2023 From: andrew at aitchison.me.uk (Andrew C Aitchison) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] incoming collections (and not) In-Reply-To: <0c0e8938-8521-0e8a-d2f3-d330a7c4205f@telefonica.net> References: <0c0e8938-8521-0e8a-d2f3-d330a7c4205f@telefonica.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Jan 2023, Carlos E. R. wrote: > El 2023-01-01 a las 21:47 -0000, Andrew C Aitchison escribi?: >> On Sun, 1 Jan 2023, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: >> You may be able to run fetchmail as a daemon using the imap idle command >> which will allow gmail to alert fetchmail that you have new messages, >> so no waiting five minutes. This does require a long-running connection to >> gmail but you don't need to set up a TLS link every five minutes. >> >> This works well with my provider but I haven't tried it with Gmail >> as I just get them to forward my mail ... > > I understand that in this mode fetchmail can only do one account. True, which reminds me that I have an alternative fetchmail directory for this, and set FETCHMAILHOME to point to this directory. (Since my gmail mail is forwarded, I don't need to collect from more than one place, but I could have a directory for each and script each one). -- Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK andrew@aitchison.me.uk From jason-alpine-info at shalott.net Mon Jan 2 00:15:35 2023 From: jason-alpine-info at shalott.net (jason-alpine-info@shalott.net) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] incoming collections (and not) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > - in the incoming folders I have two external sites > Gsuite {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=...} > RCM {pop.retecivica.milano.it/service=pop3/user=...} > > - in the normal collections I have one > "All Gsuite" {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=...}[[Gmail]]/[] > The curious thing is that when, after having just started alpine, I type > L to go the collection list screen (usually to navigate to other local > collections) > > This asks the Gsuite password (but not the RCM password). There are two (potential) things going on here. 1) You have a folder collection defined. In order for Alpine to see *what* folders exist in that collection ("Spam", "Bin", etc), it has to login to the server and issue the command to list out all those folders; otherwise, it can't show you the list of them, because it doesn't know what they are. You have a folder collection defined for Gsuite, but not RCM, so Alpine needs to login to Gsuite, but not RCM. 2) The other issue that may be in play (not in your case, but adding this for archive-searchers from the future...) is that Alpine can optionally show you the number of new/unseen messages in each incoming folder. In this case, again, it would need to login to the server and issue a search in order to find out the number of unseen messages. I have a very similar situation: my main inbox and folders (which I check often) are on a local (extremely fast, no auth required) server; but I also have an inbox/folder collection that I check much more rarely, and which is on a very slow, remote system. Literally 99% of the time, when I hit "L" to go to the list of folders/collections, I only want to see the local, fast folders, but I have to wait the extra time for Alpine to auth to the slow, remote server and then list out the folders there. I often think that I would love a way to only display the folder collections that live on the same server as the currently opened folder. So when I'm in my local inbox and I hit "L", it only shows me the local folders. To see the other inboxes and folder collections, I would hit a different key. -Jason From klewellen at shellworld.net Mon Jan 2 17:07:43 2023 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] rhs timeout issue? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: thanks very much indeed. will share this with dreamhost support, as they claimed it was a bug. On Mon, 2 Jan 2023, Bert Wendland wrote: > Hi Karen, > > You may add /norsh/ to the Inbox Path in your Alpine's configuration, > e.g.: > > Inbox Path = {imap.dreamhost.com/ssl/norsh/user=XXX}inbox > > This should avoid access to your mailbox via rsh. > > -- > Bert > > > On Fri, 30 Dec 2022, 11:41, Karen Lewellen wrote: > >> Hi folks, >> One issue being encountered with the inbox of our staff member while >> using alpine is an error referencing rhs. >> dreamhost states that alpine has a setting where it first checks for this >> type of inbox before the imap one. Or at least that it tries to >> communicate with the imap server by using rhs first. >> If this is true, where in the settings can I prevent alpine from taking >> this step? >> fills the screen with odd characters, which cannot be paused from my >> adaptive technology standpoint. >> Thanks, >> Karen >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alpine-info mailing list >> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> >> > From dclinger at qualcomm.com Mon Jan 2 23:08:46 2023 From: dclinger at qualcomm.com (Deke Clinger) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] rhs timeout issue? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, Guessing you meant 'rsh' but typed 'rhs'. To disable rsh in the settings menu find the option named "Rsh Open Timeout" and set the value to zero. This is described in comments in the .pinerc (that you mentioned you can't get to): # Sets the time in seconds that Pine will attempt to open a UNIX remote # shell connection. The default is 15, min is 5, and max is unlimited. # Zero disables rsh altogether. rsh-open-timeout=0 Regards, -Deke On Fri, 30 Dec 2022, Karen Lewellen wrote: > WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any > links or attachments, and do not enable macros. > > Hi folks, > One issue being encountered with the inbox of our staff member while > using alpine is an error referencing rhs. > dreamhost states that alpine has a setting where it first checks for this > type of inbox before the imap one. Or at least that it tries to > communicate with the imap server by using rhs first. > If this is true, where in the settings can I prevent alpine from taking > this step? > fills the screen with odd characters, which cannot be paused from my > adaptive technology standpoint. > Thanks, > Karen > > > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > > From kludev at gmail.com Sun Jan 8 03:11:46 2023 From: kludev at gmail.com (kludev) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Specify role's specific folder to match all sub-folders Message-ID: <92f7f32-143-33a0-4189-d313c262f50@gmail.com> Does this feature exist? I have a collection for my gmail account, I want to set up a role to apply "Set FROM" and "Set SMTP" (and a few others), so that as long as my current folder is in this collection, I can compose, reply, forward using the corresponding account's SMTP. Currently, I can only set up a role to specify individual folders (can be multiple, or all of them). However as long as I added a new folder in Gmail, the newly added folder won't trigger the role. This is why I would like to have the aforementioned feature. If not, I scratched a patch for this: One can specify a folder in the form of `{some_server}somefolder*`, which will match the prefix to current open folder. Wondering if it makes sense. --- pith/pattern.c.orig 2023-01-08 02:53:16 +++ pith/pattern.c 2023-01-08 02:53:40 @@ -5484,7 +5484,8 @@ (streamfolder = strindex(&stream->mailbox[1], '}')) && (t = strindex(&patfolder[1], '}')) && (!strcmp(t+1, streamfolder+1) || - (*(t+1) == '\0' && !strcmp("INBOX", streamfolder+1)))) + (*(t+1) == '\0' && !strcmp("INBOX", streamfolder+1)) || + (t[strlen(t)-1] == '*' && strncmp(t+1, streamfolder+1, strlen(t+1)-1) == 0)) match++; break; From andrew at aitchison.me.uk Tue Jan 10 08:49:04 2023 From: andrew at aitchison.me.uk (Andrew C Aitchison) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Conditionally choose between text and html view ? Message-ID: For most messages I would like to see the "plain" version, but I would like to see the HTML version of messages in a particular folder and from a single sender. I can do this by typing the letter 'A' (TogglePreferPlain) but can I automate this ? Currently display-filters detects these messages and runs a separate html viewer,or as I say, this could be triggered by the sender or the folder. Ideas ? Thanks, -- Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK andrew@aitchison.me.uk From bradcray at hpe.com Wed Jan 11 22:05:47 2023 From: bradcray at hpe.com (Brad Chamberlain) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Can Alpine render CR+LF as one newline rather than two? Message-ID: <51475938-781c-43e0-d3a2-e47eb35b89af@hpe.com> Hi Alpine Experts ? Something I've noticed for the past year or two is that mails sent to me by Discourse forums end up looking "double-spaced" in alpine, which makes them slightly excruciating to read, particularly when code is involved. While looking into why this might be yesterday, I believe I've determined that they are being formatted with (DOS-style?) CR+LF as the EOL terminator rather than just LF, and I'm guessing that alpine renders this combination as two newlines rather than one? I've started a line of inquiry as to whether Discourse can be reconfigured to just format the text version of the mail with LF, but in the meantime wanted to also see whether there's any way to request alpine to format the text version of en email such that carriage returns don't get their own linefeed (or so that CR+LF only results in a single linefeed). Any tips? I didn't see anything in the config menu that looked right. Thanks! -Brad PS ??Ironically, if I point alpine to the html version of the message, it renders much more nicely...but I'd prefer to stick with the text version given the choice... From peter at asgalon.net Sat Jan 14 04:08:40 2023 From: peter at asgalon.net (Peter Koellner) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] HTML text view Message-ID: Hi, I have reincarnated my old MacbookPro backup into a MacBookAir and installed alpine again. It works fine, only when I try to view the HTML part of an email there seems to be a problem. It does open a browser tab in firefox, but the tab is empty. Viewing an URL from plain text works without problems, though. I am using a remote setup, and on linux it works fine. So my question is: where do I have to configure the behaviour of opening HTML attachments/mail parts? I am not sure if this is inside alpine or something I have to do in mime type configurations in the system. The "URL-Viewers" setting is overridden with "open -a Firefox", I guess this is only for the url displays but not for the html mail parts? Or do I have to give a different parameter for those? Or is it configured somewhere else? Regards Peter From n1ea at arrl.net Sat Jan 14 06:16:11 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail Message-ID: Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? I had such a file but it no longer works. Thanks in advance for your help. David -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andrew at aitchison.me.uk Sat Jan 14 08:36:40 2023 From: andrew at aitchison.me.uk (Andrew C Aitchison) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? > > I had such a file but it no longer works. I am not sure that application specific passwords are still supported by google; they have been trying to replace them for some years. https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en tells you how to create and use them. Following those instructions should confirm that you still have an application specific password. Failing that, I have just confirmed that the (X)OAUTH2 support in Alpine allows me to set up and *read* my gmail via imap. I have not tested *downloading* this email. -- Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK andrew@aitchison.me.uk From robin.listas at telefonica.net Sat Jan 14 10:01:00 2023 From: robin.listas at telefonica.net (Carlos E. R.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> References: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Saturday, 2023-01-14 at 16:36 -0000, Andrew C Aitchison wrote: > On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > >> Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download >> imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? >> >> I had such a file but it no longer works. > > I am not sure that application specific passwords are still supported by > google; they have been trying to replace them for some years. They work for me. "imap Ggl C" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=NAME@gmail.com}INBOX, "imap ieee" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=NAME@ieee.org}INBOX, I am carefull to have a different password for each application or computer. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. (from openSUSE 15.4 x86_64 at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHoEARECADoWIQQZEb51mJKK1KpcU/W1MxgcbY1H1QUCY8Lt3Bwccm9iaW4ubGlz dGFzQHRlbGVmb25pY2EubmV0AAoJELUzGBxtjUfVtrgAoJKru9j6OkaS1LeJ+tKc IonAE1p3AJwKGz8kcsYJSq1gvoXcLpOkOIMDzA== =792v -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From n1ea at arrl.net Sat Jan 14 11:36:10 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> References: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> Message-ID: Thank you, Andrew. Can (X)OAUTH2 be configured in the command line only? I am trying to come up with a .pinerc file that can be generic that I could provide many blind people. They have mostly moved on to mutt because of the additional password requirements of alpine, but some remain but most if not all are having trouble since google gmail changed how they handle passwords, something in the pinerc file I had been providing them no longer works, and they get strange errors. Thanks, David On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 11:36 AM Andrew C Aitchison wrote: > On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > > > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download > > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? > > > > I had such a file but it no longer works. > > I am not sure that application specific passwords are still supported by > google; they have been trying to replace them for some years. > > https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en > tells you how to create and use them. Following those instructions should > confirm that you still have an application specific password. > > Failing that, I have just confirmed that the (X)OAUTH2 support in > Alpine allows me to set up and *read* my gmail via imap. > I have not tested *downloading* this email. > > -- > Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK > andrew@aitchison.me.uk > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n1ea at arrl.net Sat Jan 14 11:40:22 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> Message-ID: Carlos, Thank you for this. I have no idea how alpine can be used for different email accounts and how different passwords can be saved. Can you direct me to information that shows how this can be done? It would be very useful. Some of the blind users have gone to gmx.com but their support of application specific passwords is intermittent, I guess this is because they require a payment to have it work while gmail application specific password access is provided without cost. How can I use alpine with different accounts? Thanks for your help. David On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 1:01 PM Carlos E. R. wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > > > On Saturday, 2023-01-14 at 16:36 -0000, Andrew C Aitchison wrote: > > On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > > > >> Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly > download > >> imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? > >> > >> I had such a file but it no longer works. > > > > I am not sure that application specific passwords are still supported by > > google; they have been trying to replace them for some years. > > They work for me. > > "imap Ggl C" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=NAME@gmail.com}INBOX > , > > "imap ieee" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=NAME@ieee.org}INBOX > , > > I am carefull to have a different password for each application or > computer. > > - -- > Cheers, > Carlos E. R. > (from openSUSE 15.4 x86_64 at Telcontar) > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > iHoEARECADoWIQQZEb51mJKK1KpcU/W1MxgcbY1H1QUCY8Lt3Bwccm9iaW4ubGlz > dGFzQHRlbGVmb25pY2EubmV0AAoJELUzGBxtjUfVtrgAoJKru9j6OkaS1LeJ+tKc > IonAE1p3AJwKGz8kcsYJSq1gvoXcLpOkOIMDzA== > =792v > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From robin.listas at telefonica.net Sat Jan 14 12:12:51 2023 From: robin.listas at telefonica.net (Carlos E. R.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: <911e4b2c-08ea-0dc3-50fa-cd5fcc5b31fc@aitchison.me.uk> Message-ID: <2abfbf04-7d11-715a-9379-8588ad14434b@telefonica.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Content-ID: <82d2ed9f-35e6-4020-8df6-4f7f5ea874b6@Telcontar.valinor> On Saturday, 2023-01-14 at 14:40 -0500, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > Carlos, > > Thank you for this.? I have no idea how alpine can be used for different email accounts and how different?passwords can be > saved. > > Can you direct me to information that shows how this can be done?? It would be very useful.? Some of the blind users have gone > to gmx.com but their support of application specific passwords is intermittent, I guess this is because they require a payment > to have it work while gmail application? specific password access is provided without cost. > > How can I use alpine with different accounts? > > Thanks for your help. > David I use the free gmx service. Their support is quite dumb, though. I only have one password with gmx.es I don't have documentation on how to do it in Alpine. I just implemented it over the years. The basic trick is: use "roles". For sending, I have configured the system "postfix" to handle sending for several accounts. This is not trivial, but you need this: # List of SMTP servers for sending mail. If blank: Unix Pine uses sendmail. smtp-server=localhost Other people do that differently, and hopefully, easier. Let me check my alpine config file, for receiving and compossing. alt-addresses=robin.listas@telefonica.net, robin2.listas@tiscali.es, robin.listas@gmail.com, robin.listas@gmx.es incoming-folders="imap Tesa L" {imap.telefonica.net/tls/user=NAME}INBOX, "imap Ggl L" {imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=robin.listas@gmail.com}INBOX, "imap Gmx L" {imap.gmx.com/tls/user=robin.listas@gmx.es}INBOX patterns-roles=... LIT:pattern="/NICK=Carlos E. R. (tesa - listas)/FLDTYPE=SPEC/FOLDER={localhost}_Lists\/in_rst_3,{localhost}_Lists\/in_rst_3,{localhost}_Lists\/in__hls,{localhost}_Lists\/in_rst_000,{localhost}_Lists\/os-es,{localhost}_Lists\/os-es,{localhost}_Lists\/in_dups,{localhost}_Lists\/t_kde-es,{localhost}_Lists\/os-trans-es" action="/ROLE=1/FROM=\"Carlos E. R.\" /FCC=\/home\/cer\/Mail\/_Lists\/list-sent/SIG=.signature.spanish.lists/TEMPLATE=/RTYPE=YES/FTYPE=YES/CTYPE=NO", LIT:pattern="/NICK=Carlos E. R. (GMX - lists)/FLDTYPE=EMAIL" action="/INICK=Carlos E. R. (tesa - lists)/ROLE=1/FROM=\"Carlos E. R.\" /FCC=\/home\/cer\/Mail\/_Lists\/list-sent-gx/RTYPE=YES/FTYPE=YES/CTYPE=YES", LIT:pattern="/NICK=Carlos E. R. (gmail - listas)/FLDTYPE=SPEC/FOLDER={localhost}_Lists\/in_dups,{localhost}_Lists\/y_gml_os-es" action="/ROLE=1/FROM=\"Carlos E. R.\" /FCC=\/home\/cer\/Mail\/_Lists\/list-sent-g/SIG=.signature.spanish.lists/RTYPE=YES/FTYPE=YES/CTYPE=NO", The above is difficult or impossible to parse for a human. Instead, you set "roles" in setup / rules / roles: (R) Rules: This has up to six sub-categories: Roles, Index Colors, Filters, SetScores, Search, and Other. If the Index Colors option is missing you may turn it on (if possible) with Setup/Kolor. If Roles is missing it has probably been administratively disabled. You get a long display page. I copy mine for gmx here, enclosed between lines like this: +++???????????????????????? text goes in the middle. ????????????????????????++- +++???????????????????????? ALPINE 2.26 CHANGE THIS ROLE RULE [H] imap Tesa L 5,485 Msgs + Nickname = Carlos E. R. (GMX - lists) Comment = ============================================== CURRENT FOLDER CONDITIONS BEGIN HERE ============================================== Current Folder Type = Set Choose One --- -------------------- ( ) Any ( ) News (*) Email ( ) Specific (Enter Incoming Nicknames or use ^T) Folder List = ============================================= CURRENT MESSAGE CONDITIONS BEGIN HERE ============================================== To pattern = - From pattern = Sender pattern = Cc pattern = News pattern = Subject pattern = Recip pattern = Partic pattern = Add Extra Headers AllText pattern = BdyText pattern = Age interval = Size interval = Score interval = Keyword pattern = Charset pattern = Message is Important? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Message is New (Unseen)? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Message is Recent? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Message is Deleted? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Message is Answered? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Subject contains raw 8-bit? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Beginning of Month? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Beginning of Year? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes ( ) No Address in address book? = Set Choose One --- -------------------- (*) Don't care, always matches ( ) Yes, in any address book ( ) No, not in any address book ( ) Yes, in specific address books ( ) No, not in any of specific address books Abook List = Types of addresses to check for in address book = Set Address types --- -------------------- [X] From [X] Reply-To [ ] Sender [ ] To [ ] Cc External Categorizer Commands = Command = Exit Status Interval = Character Limit = ======================================================= ACTIONS BEGIN HERE ======================================================= Initialize settings using role : Carlos E. R. (tesa - lists) Set From = "Carlos E. R." Set Reply-To = Set Fcc = /home/cer/Mail/_Lists/list-sent-gx Set LiteralSig = Set Signature = Set Template = Set Other Hdrs = Use SMTP Server = Use NNTP Server = ======================================================= OPTIONS BEGIN HERE ======================================================= Features = Set Feature Name --- -------------------- [ ] use-date-header-for-age ======================================================== USES BEGIN HERE ========================================================= Reply Use = Set Choose One --- -------------------- ( ) Never (*) With confirmation ( ) Without confirmation Forward Use = Set Choose One --- -------------------- ( ) Never (*) With confirmation ( ) Without confirmation Compose Use = Set Choose One --- -------------------- ( ) Never (*) With confirmation ( ) Without confirmation ????????????????????????++- I hope that helps you. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. (from openSUSE 15.4 x86_64 at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHoEARECADoWIQQZEb51mJKK1KpcU/W1MxgcbY1H1QUCY8MMwxwccm9iaW4ubGlz dGFzQHRlbGVmb25pY2EubmV0AAoJELUzGBxtjUfV0swAnRmxyLW1FIlx5unnyXia kCvTm8ZhAKCDWTQYqsgaZRepJkl0VpjoM8ATVQ== =3YMS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lucio at lambrate.inaf.it Sat Jan 14 12:35:22 2023 From: lucio at lambrate.inaf.it (Lucio Chiappetti) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? I use these two for my institutional account managed by Gsuite (so domain in name@domain is NOT gmail.com) The first entry is one incoming folder. It sees the content of the Gsuite INBOX (and only that) for the 5 minutes when an incoming message stays there. My default arrangement is to move all valid mail locally to my machine with a crontab-operated fetchmail every 5 min The second is a folder collection. I use it to access any other Gsuite folder but inbox. Since I do not keep any serious message on gmail for more than 24 hours, this is used: (a) to check the Spam folder; (b) to expunge the Bin folder, where message retrieved by fetchmail are temporarily "deleted" Gsuite {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=name@domain} "All Gsuite" {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=name@domain}[[Gmail]]/[] details on my useage of fetchmail are in here http://sax.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/WWW/WhereManWins/gs.html -- Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Corti 12 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ A middle rank researcher at end career is not rich but is in the top 5% of the Italian income tax taxpayers. Does it not sound strange ? From peter at asgalon.net Tue Jan 17 13:42:58 2023 From: peter at asgalon.net (Peter Koellner) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] HTML text view In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <29fe2e16-23c0-d297-b4d6-5419e346300b@asgalon.net> One more thing to add: Trying to open the HTML part leads to the following message popping up: 2023-01-17 22:33:00.812 alpine[1261:16503] CFPropertyListCreateFromXMLData(): Old-style plist parser: missing semicolon in dictionary on line 1. Parsing will be abandoned. Break on _CFPropertyListMissingSemicolon to debug. I don't see that symbol in the source code, grep -r CFPropertyList in alpine does not yield any results, so I guess this comes from some mac library, seems to have to do something with XML parsing... On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, Peter Koellner wrote: > Hi, > > I have reincarnated my old MacbookPro backup into a MacBookAir and > installed alpine again. It works fine, only when I try to view the > HTML part of an email there seems to be a problem. It does open a > browser tab in firefox, but the tab is empty. Viewing an URL from > plain text works without problems, though. I am using a remote setup, > and on linux it works fine. So my question is: where do I have to > configure the behaviour of opening HTML attachments/mail parts? I am > not sure if this is inside alpine or something I have to do in mime > type configurations in the system. The "URL-Viewers" setting is > overridden with "open -a Firefox", I guess this is only for the url > displays but not for the html mail parts? Or do I have to give a > different parameter for those? Or is it configured somewhere else? > > Regards > Peter > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -- From peter at asgalon.net Tue Jan 17 14:59:53 2023 From: peter at asgalon.net (Peter Koellner) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] HTML text view In-Reply-To: <29fe2e16-23c0-d297-b4d6-5419e346300b@asgalon.net> References: <29fe2e16-23c0-d297-b4d6-5419e346300b@asgalon.net> Message-ID: <0e2a71ac-5f93-d885-7dc0-b15225b5abbb@asgalon.net> Just for the record: created a ~/.mailcap file containing: application/*; /usr/bin/open %s audio/*; /usr/bin/open %s image/*; /usr/bin/open %s text/*; /usr/bin/open %s video/*; /usr/bin/open %s and then set an exception for Mailcap-Path in configuration settings to ~/.mailcap on macos This then opens the temporary file path correctly, though images loaded from other mime parts in the mail are missing, not sure how that works. Our rental office loves to send emails with annopuncements where they put all the text as a rendered image with fancy fonts and eye candy and whatnot in an otherwise empty embedded html page microsoft-style and leave the plain text part empty, so I have to figure that out too. This plist error below came from some really ancient preferences launcher configuration that was restored from the old machine's backup. So the main problem is more or less solved. Regards Peter On Tue, 17 Jan 2023, Peter Koellner wrote: > One more thing to add: Trying to open the HTML part leads to the following > message popping up: > > 2023-01-17 22:33:00.812 alpine[1261:16503] > CFPropertyListCreateFromXMLData(): Old-style plist parser: missing > semicolon in dictionary on line 1. Parsing will be abandoned. Break on > _CFPropertyListMissingSemicolon to debug. > > I don't see that symbol in the source code, grep -r CFPropertyList in > alpine does not yield any results, so I guess this comes from some mac > library, seems to have to do something with XML parsing... > > > On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, Peter Koellner wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I have reincarnated my old MacbookPro backup into a MacBookAir and >> installed alpine again. It works fine, only when I try to view the >> HTML part of an email there seems to be a problem. It does open a >> browser tab in firefox, but the tab is empty. Viewing an URL from >> plain text works without problems, though. I am using a remote setup, >> and on linux it works fine. So my question is: where do I have to >> configure the behaviour of opening HTML attachments/mail parts? I am >> not sure if this is inside alpine or something I have to do in mime >> type configurations in the system. The "URL-Viewers" setting is >> overridden with "open -a Firefox", I guess this is only for the url >> displays but not for the html mail parts? Or do I have to give a >> different parameter for those? Or is it configured somewhere else? >> >> Regards >> Peter >> _______________________________________________ >> Alpine-info mailing list >> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> > > -- From mattack at apple.com Tue Jan 17 17:30:04 2023 From: mattack at apple.com (Matt Ackeret) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] HTML text view In-Reply-To: <29fe2e16-23c0-d297-b4d6-5419e346300b@asgalon.net> References: <29fe2e16-23c0-d297-b4d6-5419e346300b@asgalon.net> Message-ID: <4DF10AD9-90B6-4FA9-8ACE-C2119DE4B8F7@apple.com> > On Jan 17, 2023, at 1:42 PM, Peter Koellner wrote: > > One more thing to add: Trying to open the HTML part leads to the following > message popping up: > > 2023-01-17 22:33:00.812 alpine[1261:16503] > CFPropertyListCreateFromXMLData(): Old-style plist parser: missing > semicolon in dictionary on line 1. Parsing will be abandoned. Break on > _CFPropertyListMissingSemicolon to debug. FYI, this is a message from the operating system. You can ignore it. I don't use FireFox, but I just successfully opened a url from alpine 2.20.17 in Safari, from the html part of a message. I don't have a .mailcap file set up, and the only URL-Viewers setting I have is for an internal URL type, so nothing for web URLs. From n1ea at arrl.net Wed Jan 25 12:06:13 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm not using Gsuit, I'm just a regular user who attempts to help blind users have a simple way to access their email. It's frustrating getting people to appreciate how difficult it is for most blind computer users to use the Graphical User Interface. Also speech dispatcher under the command line text interface is flawlessly excellent, and being keyboard command driven, it's a wonderful match for blind users. I have tried in the past to get the developer of the excellent lynx command Internet browser to include in his release an alternative lynx.cfg confusion file which eliminates the constant need to override objections of lynx to access websites. I cannot say that he is unaware of blind users difficulties, but I can say that he probably is unaware of just how difficult and impossible for nearly all blind users - the ones not trained in computers to read lynx.cfg which is over 153k in size with a screen reader that speaks to you and often reads what in the file are strings as "words" which the blind user has to scroll through letter by letter using his cursor keys. I've asked the developer of Alpine to provide a version of Alpine that has none of the added security and need for a password for alpine itself, and he has generously provided me with instructions on how to remove this need for a password, but it must be done on each users installation of Alpine. Frankly, and without judgement in any negative way, most blind users are unable to follow these clear but multiple step instructions. Back to a pinerc file that blind users can use to access Gmail and download their email. The file we are using now only shows the INBOX, and one user I am helping has 10,000 emails in "ALL MAIL". Any and all help would be appreciated. Years ago we had such a file that worked and showed all the folders and it was hosted on the now defunct but excellent Vinux based on Ubuntu for the blind website. It seems no one has a copy of that pinerc file. Thanks, David On Sat, Jan 14, 2023, 15:35 Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > > > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download > > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? > > I use these two for my institutional account managed by Gsuite (so domain > in name@domain is NOT gmail.com) > > The first entry is one incoming folder. It sees the content of the Gsuite > INBOX (and only that) for the 5 minutes when an incoming message stays > there. > > My default arrangement is to move all valid mail locally to my machine > with a crontab-operated fetchmail every 5 min > > The second is a folder collection. I use it to access any other Gsuite > folder but inbox. Since I do not keep any serious message on gmail for > more than 24 hours, this is used: (a) to check the Spam folder; (b) to > expunge the Bin folder, where message retrieved by fetchmail are > temporarily "deleted" > > Gsuite > {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=name@domain} > > "All Gsuite" > {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=name@domain}[[Gmail]]/[] > > > > details on my useage of fetchmail are in here > http://sax.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/WWW/WhereManWins/gs.html > > -- > Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Corti 12 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) > For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > A middle rank researcher at end career is not rich but is in the top 5% > of the Italian income tax taxpayers. Does it not sound strange ? > > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n1ea at arrl.net Fri Jan 27 15:21:26 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Does anyone have such a file that downloads email directly from the gmail IMAP server? This is what some of us used to have: # List of SMTP servers for sending mail. If blank: Unix Alpine uses sendmail. smtp-server=smtp.gmail.com/ssl/user=MYUSERNAME@gmail.com # Path of (local or remote) INBOX, e.g. ={mail.somewhere.edu}inbox # Normal Unix default is the local INBOX (usually /usr/spool/mail/$USER). inbox-path={imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=MYUSERNAME@gmail.com}INBOX One problem is that gmail has changed things, all mail doesn't go to INBOX anymore, but you need to switch to ALL MAIL folder. Most of the blind users have migrated to the less useful mutt program, Some are trying the new aerc email program. Alpine has gone from the easiest email program for the blind to one that is more difficult - but Google / GMAIL shares some of the blame for now allowing regular passwords and now requiring application specific passwords. Is there any method of configuring Alpine for multiple mail addresses? Many of the blind users have gone over to gmx.com because of the problems with gmail and application specific passwords. Most of these people cannot navigate a graphical interface. If you've tried it with your eyes shut, you know what I'm taking about. Awaiting any possible help, David On Wed, Jan 25, 2023 at 3:06 PM D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > I'm not using Gsuit, I'm just a regular user who attempts to help blind > users have a simple way to access their email. > > It's frustrating getting people to appreciate how difficult it is for most > blind computer users to use the Graphical User Interface. Also speech > dispatcher under the command line text interface is flawlessly excellent, > and being keyboard command driven, it's a wonderful match for blind users. > > I have tried in the past to get the developer of the excellent lynx > command Internet browser to include in his release an alternative lynx.cfg > confusion file which eliminates the constant need to override objections of > lynx to access websites. I cannot say that he is unaware of blind users > difficulties, but I can say that he probably is unaware of just how > difficult and impossible for nearly all blind users - the ones not trained > in computers to read lynx.cfg which is over 153k in size with a screen > reader that speaks to you and often reads what in the file are strings as > "words" which the blind user has to scroll through letter by letter using > his cursor keys. > > I've asked the developer of Alpine to provide a version of Alpine that has > none of the added security and need for a password for alpine itself, and > he has generously provided me with instructions on how to remove this need > for a password, but it must be done on each users installation of Alpine. > > Frankly, and without judgement in any negative way, most blind users are > unable to follow these clear but multiple step instructions. > > Back to a pinerc file that blind users can use to access Gmail and > download their email. > > The file we are using now only shows the INBOX, and one user I am helping > has 10,000 emails in "ALL MAIL". > > Any and all help would be appreciated. > > Years ago we had such a file that worked and showed all the folders and it > was hosted on the now defunct but excellent Vinux based on Ubuntu for the > blind website. It seems no one has a copy of that pinerc file. > > Thanks, > > David > > On Sat, Jan 14, 2023, 15:35 Lucio Chiappetti > wrote: > >> On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: >> >> > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly download >> > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? >> >> I use these two for my institutional account managed by Gsuite (so domain >> in name@domain is NOT gmail.com) >> >> The first entry is one incoming folder. It sees the content of the Gsuite >> INBOX (and only that) for the 5 minutes when an incoming message stays >> there. >> >> My default arrangement is to move all valid mail locally to my machine >> with a crontab-operated fetchmail every 5 min >> >> The second is a folder collection. I use it to access any other Gsuite >> folder but inbox. Since I do not keep any serious message on gmail for >> more than 24 hours, this is used: (a) to check the Spam folder; (b) to >> expunge the Bin folder, where message retrieved by fetchmail are >> temporarily "deleted" >> >> Gsuite >> {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=name@domain} >> >> "All Gsuite" >> {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=name@domain}[[Gmail]]/[] >> >> >> >> details on my useage of fetchmail are in here >> http://sax.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/WWW/WhereManWins/gs.html >> >> -- >> Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Corti 12 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) >> For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> A middle rank researcher at end career is not rich but is in the top 5% >> of the Italian income tax taxpayers. Does it not sound strange ? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alpine-info mailing list >> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n1ea at arrl.net Fri Jan 27 19:28:15 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Alpine and GMX mail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Blind using Alpine - Continued As I previously mentioned, blind users who previously used gmail got hit with a ONE, TWO punch with Alpine. First, gmail needed a application specific password but it seems that this must be done in a graphical user interface which is beyond many (but not all) of blind users. I've been trusted by some to obtain their application specific password. So far so good. Then Alpine changed to require a long password to even open the application, this is another complicated process to remove it, I've guided some through the process which isn't too difficult for those who can see, but if your blind it is a challenge. Some of the users have moved to gmx.com mail but that's what I'am writing about today. I have a pinerc file that can read (at least) the INBOX, I cannot see the other folders but the INBOX is visible. BUT I canno send mail! Here's the line I have in pinerc. smtp-server=mail.gmx.com/novalidate-cert/ssl/user=USERNAME@gmx.com I get the ERROR "Mail not sent: bad sequence of commands" I found this suggestion in this lists archived that I should put this in. Customized Headers = From: "fName lName" myaddress@gmx.com But that didn't work, and I couldn't put FIRST_NAME LAST_NAME because alpiine rejected this it says "no spaces allowed". Anyone have a clue? He needs to use gmx until I get Gmail working in Alpine and I'm getting close to doing that Regards, David -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From damion.yates at gmail.com Sat Jan 28 10:33:02 2023 From: damion.yates at gmail.com (Damion Yates) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Alpine and GMX mail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Jan 2023 at 03:28, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > Blind using Alpine - Continued > > As I previously mentioned, blind users who previously used gmail got hit > with a ONE, TWO punch with Alpine. > > First, gmail needed a application specific password but it seems that this > must be done in a graphical user interface which is beyond many (but not > all) of blind users. > I assumed they blocked app specific passwords to be honest, they did where I work, xoauth2 is the new hotness and ALPINE gained this support over the past year or so as it's kicked in for people with Google apps domains. This is probably quite finicky for most to configure without some help I'm afraid. But the good news is that it'll cache the auth tokens so pine can just work as intended. There are threads on this in the list and others who can help, I'm limited in my available time but did want to speak out about the options and what is happening. Google/GMail are trying to do the right thing, single passwd access is awfully insecure and people forget that this is often the method used for account recovery for banks, where authentication numbers are sent for that etc. Keeping it secure is sensible. On my own apps domain I was also able to disable the ASP/xoauth2 enforcement and return to the insecure single password option. This might also help. This is mostly temporarily laziness by the way, I plan to switch to xoauth2 when I find time. > I've been trusted by some to obtain their application specific password. > > So far so good. > > Then Alpine changed to require a long password to even open the > application, this is another complicated process to remove it, I've guided > some through the process which isn't too difficult for those who can see, > but if your blind it is a challenge. > I'm unsure what this is. Alpine doesn't didn't do this for me unless I've configured it with a passfile and even then it needn't be long. Is this very new? Is this a distribution issue on some linux distribution or macos? > Some of the users have moved to gmx.com mail but that's what I'am writing > about today. > > I have a pinerc file that can read (at least) the INBOX, I cannot see the > other folders but the INBOX is visible. > > BUT I canno send mail! > > Here's the line I have in pinerc. > > smtp-server=mail.gmx.com/novalidate-cert/ssl/user=USERNAME@gmx.com > > I get the ERROR "Mail not sent: bad sequence of commands" > I suspect this might need /tls rather than /ssl or something similar (the docs have several options) depending on the protocol used by gmx. There are older threads mentioning this. There are various ways providers can permit, with starttls and ssl from the start etc. > I found this suggestion in this lists archived that I should put this in. > Customized Headers = From: "fName lName" myaddress@gmx.com > > But that didn't work, and I couldn't put FIRST_NAME LAST_NAME because > alpiine rejected this it says "no spaces allowed". > > Anyone have a clue? > > He needs to use gmx until I get Gmail working in Alpine and I'm getting > close to doing that > Sorry I don't know more specifics about the sending email issue with gmx. - Damion -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From damion.yates at gmail.com Sat Jan 28 10:50:39 2023 From: damion.yates at gmail.com (Damion Yates) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] PINERC file for accessing Gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Jan 2023 at 23:22, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > Does anyone have such a file that downloads email directly from the gmail > IMAP server? > I use offlineimap.py which syncs a Maildir compatible hierarchy to my home directory which alpine can read from. I have a feeling that unfortunately this and Alpine (and one would assume Mutt), all need a brief moment in a browser to sort the *once off* approval of the xoauth2 token before things can carry on. At least that was as I understood it, the change to the localhost kludge Eduardo nicely implemented recently, might be able to do a lot of this transparently without needing a browser for a moment. I use a mix of direct IMAP (xoauth2) and Maildir (offlineimap doing xoauth2, alpine doing Maildir). Some IMAP functions are a smidge latency/laggy, others are way faster even than my local SSD can handle for Maildir. > This is what some of us used to have: > > # List of SMTP servers for sending mail. If blank: Unix Alpine uses > sendmail. > smtp-server=smtp.gmail.com/ssl/user=MYUSERNAME@gmail.com > > # Path of (local or remote) INBOX, e.g. ={mail.somewhere.edu}inbox > # Normal Unix default is the local INBOX (usually /usr/spool/mail/$USER). > inbox-path={imap.gmail.com/ssl/user=MYUSERNAME@gmail.com}INBOX > > > One problem is that gmail has changed things, all mail doesn't go to INBOX > anymore, but you need to switch to ALL MAIL folder. > This is odd. I assumed the only emails not in INBOX were what you'd deleted (does an archive in gmail depending on your config), or spam. The other option is somebody has added filters, moving emails into labels (account hacked?). I guess another option is that Google have implemented some weird new features auto-separating things like promotions/social/commercial, using machine learning!? I've not seen this and I use gmail all the time! The IMAP settings allow for a lot of things, which folders are exposed over IMAP, only showing the last 1000 messages, what does "Delete" mean, does it auto archive, actually delete, does it expunge on its own? These do need you to use the UI for a bit, but only once. > Most of the blind users have migrated to the less useful mutt program, > Some are trying the new aerc email program. > Mutt with GMails imap should be strictly inferior to Alpine with GMails imap IMO (I work with people using both). The problems you've mentioned aren't client specific but IMAP implementation and personal configuration specific on gmail. > Alpine has gone from the easiest email program for the blind to one that > is more difficult - but Google / GMAIL shares some of the blame for now > allowing regular passwords and now requiring application specific passwords. > > Is there any method of configuring Alpine for multiple mail addresses? > Many of the blind users have gone over to gmx.com because of the problems > with gmail and application specific passwords. > > Most of these people cannot navigate a graphical interface. If you've > tried it with your eyes shut, you know what I'm taking about. > I wish I had a better answer. I know blind users who do use the browser UIs, those screen readers have complex
searching heuristics and/or many pages have newer standardised hints for those. But also a lot of this just needs help once by somebody who can quickly configure stuff so the user can return to the cmdline. As a UNIX veteran of many decades I spend almost my entire time in an XTerm in screen using alpine, so I do appreciate and have also observed the world getting harder to continue purely from the cmdline. I used to argue for cmdline alternatives for GUI/web systems people developed, and often cited the blind - hoping accessibility would help my nerdy cause (I have sight but just love the cmdline). However I was led to believe that modern screen readers are actually quite superior with intentional hinted UIs these days. It's interesting to hear otherwise. LMK if my non top-posting (which is usually preferred on this list), is actually a hindrance for you or the blind users. - Damion > On Wed, Jan 25, 2023 at 3:06 PM D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: > >> I'm not using Gsuit, I'm just a regular user who attempts to help blind >> users have a simple way to access their email. >> >> It's frustrating getting people to appreciate how difficult it is for >> most blind computer users to use the Graphical User Interface. Also speech >> dispatcher under the command line text interface is flawlessly excellent, >> and being keyboard command driven, it's a wonderful match for blind users. >> >> I have tried in the past to get the developer of the excellent lynx >> command Internet browser to include in his release an alternative lynx.cfg >> confusion file which eliminates the constant need to override objections of >> lynx to access websites. I cannot say that he is unaware of blind users >> difficulties, but I can say that he probably is unaware of just how >> difficult and impossible for nearly all blind users - the ones not trained >> in computers to read lynx.cfg which is over 153k in size with a screen >> reader that speaks to you and often reads what in the file are strings as >> "words" which the blind user has to scroll through letter by letter using >> his cursor keys. >> >> I've asked the developer of Alpine to provide a version of Alpine that >> has none of the added security and need for a password for alpine itself, >> and he has generously provided me with instructions on how to remove this >> need for a password, but it must be done on each users installation of >> Alpine. >> >> Frankly, and without judgement in any negative way, most blind users are >> unable to follow these clear but multiple step instructions. >> >> Back to a pinerc file that blind users can use to access Gmail and >> download their email. >> >> The file we are using now only shows the INBOX, and one user I am helping >> has 10,000 emails in "ALL MAIL". >> >> Any and all help would be appreciated. >> >> Years ago we had such a file that worked and showed all the folders and >> it was hosted on the now defunct but excellent Vinux based on Ubuntu for >> the blind website. It seems no one has a copy of that pinerc file. >> >> Thanks, >> >> David >> >> On Sat, Jan 14, 2023, 15:35 Lucio Chiappetti >> wrote: >> >>> On Sat, 14 Jan 2023, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote: >>> >>> > Does anyone have an example of a .pinerc file that can directly >>> download >>> > imap mail from Gmail using an application specific password? >>> >>> I use these two for my institutional account managed by Gsuite (so >>> domain >>> in name@domain is NOT gmail.com) >>> >>> The first entry is one incoming folder. It sees the content of the >>> Gsuite >>> INBOX (and only that) for the 5 minutes when an incoming message stays >>> there. >>> >>> My default arrangement is to move all valid mail locally to my machine >>> with a crontab-operated fetchmail every 5 min >>> >>> The second is a folder collection. I use it to access any other Gsuite >>> folder but inbox. Since I do not keep any serious message on gmail for >>> more than 24 hours, this is used: (a) to check the Spam folder; (b) to >>> expunge the Bin folder, where message retrieved by fetchmail are >>> temporarily "deleted" >>> >>> Gsuite >>> {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/novalidate-cert/notls/user=name@domain} >>> >>> "All Gsuite" >>> {imap.gmail.com:993/ssl/notls/user=name@domain}[[Gmail]]/[] >>> >>> >>> >>> details on my useage of fetchmail are in here >>> http://sax.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/WWW/WhereManWins/gs.html >>> >>> -- >>> Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Corti 12 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) >>> For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> A middle rank researcher at end career is not rich but is in the top 5% >>> of the Italian income tax taxpayers. Does it not sound strange ? >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Alpine-info mailing list >>> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >>> http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >>> >> _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n1ea at arrl.net Sat Jan 28 12:54:50 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Alpine and GMX mail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > I found this suggestion in this lists archived that I should put this in. > Customized Headers = From: "fName lName" myaddress@gmx.com > Today it works, go figure. No errors. Here's the line I use and it now sends mail to gmx.com. customized-hdrs=From: "Jim Smith" Thanks, David -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n1ea at arrl.net Sat Jan 28 13:05:46 2023 From: n1ea at arrl.net (D.J.J. Ring, Jr.) Date: Fri Mar 22 14:17:32 2024 Subject: [Alpine-info] Alpine and GMX mail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I wrote: > > Then Alpine changed to require a long password to even open the > application, this is another complicated process to remove it, I've guided > some through the process which isn't too difficult for those who can see, > but if your blind it is a challenge. > Damion Yates replied: I'm unsure what this is. Alpine doesn't didn't do this for me unless I've configured it with a passfile and even then it needn't be long. Is this very new? Is this a distribution issue on some linux distribution or macos? The new alpine password is fairly new. Eduardo gave me the method to remove it, perhaps your using an older version of alpine before this was implemented. I'm using Alpine 2.25, and to remove the Alpine password you have to do this. Start alpine Press C for setup Press M for S/MIME Scroll all the way to the bottom to: Manage Password File Key and Certificate Again go to the very bottom where it says "Current Public Certificate and Key: Highlight the entry under that, and press enter. You will be asked for your Alpine password - NOT your email password, and you will then be able to remove your Alpine password. Follow the instructions and delete your Alpine password. Regards, David -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: