[Tweeters] LBBG Queries

. KDB . buhrdz at hotmail.com
Wed Apr 4 16:44:50 PDT 2007


Hello, Since I have been a proponent of the "let's consider all
species/sub-species" camp since the very first Washington LBBG was reported
several years ago, I figured I had the obligation to chime in.
My interest in this topic began when I saw a gull on the shores of the
arctic ocean in Alaska which sported yellow legs, a very dark back and dark
eyes. Many who have reviewed these photographs consider it consistant with
heuglini and one Korean gull watcher said "appears to be the same taxon that
we in Korea are now considering to be barabensis...".
A query was sent out several years ago on Frontiers of ID to European
gullers; "what proportion of LBBG's which you have seen have dark eyes?"
"None" came back the answer.
Several years ago I was at Key West and noticed a wounded gull in a rehabers
enclosure which had yellow legs a dark back and most curiously, dark eyes. A
feather was procured from this bird and DNA analysis revealed this: "We
managed to obtain a full 1143 bp cytB sequence from this feather and it has
a unique sequenc with 1 bp difference to haplotype 126 in our article. With
this it falls perfectly within a group of sequence types found among
graelsii's. Haplotype 126 was from a Faeroe breeding bird. Although this not
formally excludes the possibility of it being one of the more eastern fuscus
taxa, it makes it much more likely to be a dark-eyed graelsii".
In any event, as I've been concerned with for a number of years,
what you expect is in no way a method to identify what you have.
If Alaska overlooks alternative ID's to LBBG (which they seemingly do), no
wonder there is no precedent for the occurance of alternative
species/sub-species.
Would it be such a wonder if interior species of gull from Asia prefer
interior portions of our state?
I believe none of the anecdotal evedence as yet provided, excludes the Asian
birds as a source.
So long story short, I am not saying that our LBBG's didn't come from the
east and are indeed LBBG's, just that all the reported LBBG's in the Pacific
Northwest may not be that simply identified; keep an open mind and let's try
to nail these down.
Thanks to Mike and Ryan for keeping this question on the front burner.
Cameron, hope you always still have all your toes and fingers (he wagered
them towards LBBG)
Thanks,
Keith Brady
Olympia.WA









"We managed to obtain a full 1143 bp cytB sequence from this feather and it

>has a unique sequenc with 1 bp difference to haplotype 126 in our article.

>With this it falls perfectly within a group of sequence types found among

>graelsii's. Haplotype 126 was from a Faeroe breeding bird.

>

>Although this not formally excludes the possibility of it being one of the

>more eastern fuscus taxa, it makes it much more likely to be a dark-eyed

>graelsii.


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