[Tweeters] Reporting - was "new yard bird"

[Louise via Tweeters]

Thank you, Gary. That is reflective of the way I have always counted for
ebird purposes.

Louise Rutter
Kirkland

On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 8:59 AM <gsmith at smithandstark.com> wrote:


> From eBird:

> https://support.ebird.org/en/support/solutions/articles/48000838845

>

>

>

> *Birds at feeders*

>

> Whether your feeder is nectar-filled and aswarm with frantically feeding

> hummingbirds or a thistle tube liberally coated with finches, it can be

> hard to know how many birds are truly there. We recommend reporting the highest

> number of individuals seen at one time during the observation period, as

> well as any clearly different individuals. Although there may actually be

> more individuals, it’s the most reliable method for these situations.

> Obviously if you see 6 female Northern Cardinals and 3 males, and later see

> 6 males together, then you have at least 12 different cardinals at your

> feeder, and your checklist should reflect this.

>

>

>

>

>

> Gary T. Smith

>

> Boise, ID (formerly Seattle)

>

>

>

> *From:* Tweeters <tweeters-bounces at mailman11.u.washington.edu> *On Behalf

> Of *Dennis Paulson via Tweeters

> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 28, 2025 9:18 AM

> *To:* Greg <gjpluth at gmail.com>

> *Cc:* Louise <louiserutter1000 at gmail.com>; TWEETERS tweeters <

> tweeters at u.washington.edu>

> *Subject:* Re: [Tweeters] Reporting - was "new yard bird"

>

>

>

> Hello tweeters,

>

>

>

> I hope there are no projects in which people are really encouraged to

> “count every bird,” as in the course of a birding day (or hour), you may

> see the very same bird again and again (a wren in your yard, an eagle on a

> tree you pass coming and going, a harrier flying over the same field three

> hours apart), and that would be very misleading.

>

>

>

> On the other hand, it does put the onus on us to think about the birds we

> are seeing. If we know we have only one wren, then we are sure that it is

> the same bird. If we drive past the tree two or three times, we have no

> reason to believe it isn’t the same eagle. So we would count “one” each

> time. I guess they are just saying that it is our responsibility to keep

> track of the birds we see as well as we can. And I would go for one

> harrier, not two, even though I saw them at different times. Unless of

> course they were in different plumages, another important factor to keep

> track of when counting birds.

>

>

>

> There are so many cases in which these hard decisions have to be made. You

> drop by a particular shoreline and there are about 100 Dunlins feeding

> there. You come back three hours later, and there are about 25. Did a

> predator take 75 of them? Did 75 fly away and leave their flock mates? Or

> it a different flock, and you should tally 125? My thought would always be

> to be conservative and assume the other 75 were somewhere else.

>

>

>

> I think it is always best to give minimum numbers, not maximum numbers.

> We’re not doing the ornithological record or bird conservation any service

> by overcounting, nor by overestimating.

>

>

>

> Dennis Paulson

>

> Seattle

>

>

>

> On Jan 27, 2025, at 11:05 PM, Greg via Tweeters <tweeters at u.washington.edu>

> wrote:

>

>

>

> Hi Louise and Jim -

>

> Since I am not privy to the complete conversation with Cornell, my feeling

> is that it might be best to question them again for clarification on the

> specifics mentioned here regarding counting every observation even if very

> likely it’s a repeat. Obviously we all are trying to gather a true picture

> with our counting.

>

> I have seen a Bewick’s Wren occasionally near my feeders every day for

> several weeks now. I’ve never seen two simultaneously during this time. If

> I stood at my kitchen window for a long periods, I’m sure I would see it on

> multiple occasions in the course of a day. It would certainly be misleading

> and bad science to count it on every occasion.

>

> I believe it is important to paint a true picture of numbers of birds

> especially when submitting to eBird. I rely on the information in eBird

> when birding excursions take me to unfamiliar places. I hope we’re all on

> the same page in this regard.

>

>

>

> Greg Pluth

>

> University Place

>

>

>

>

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

>

>

> On Jan 27, 2025, at 9:01 PM, Louise via Tweeters <

> tweeters at u.washington.edu> wrote:

>

> 

>

> Many thanks for all these details, Jim.

>

>

>

> My criteria for keeping my own personal yard list are definitely my own. I

> want to know which birds are using the habitat I provide, not every bird

> that might pass through the general area.

>

>

>

> When I'm listing for ebird or whatever, I do make note of every bird I

> see/hear, however distant. It's interesting, though, that Cornell encourage

> us to count every bird, even when it's highly likely to be a repeat. My

> tendency in those circumstances has been to count the minimum number of

> birds rather than the maximum, because I have indeed been worried about

> over-counting. Certainly on the CBCs I've been on, I've been encouraged to

> count that way to avoid over-counting.

>

>

>

> Does anyone know of there are specific criteria for CBCs that differ from

> those of Cornell?

>

>

>

> Louise Rutter

>

> Kirkland

>

>

>

> On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 12:24 PM via Tweeters <tweeters at u.washington.edu>

> wrote:

>

> Louise,

>

>   Back when I was first starting to use eBird I asked this specific

> question

> about my checklists.  Specifically - "when do you report (count) a bird?"

> and gave the example of my backyard feeder and the fact that I could

> see birds coming and going ... but suspected - highly - that some/many

> of them were 'repeats' and had been there as short a time ago as only a

> few minutes.

>

>   The answer I got was "if you don't know for certain it is the same bird -

> count it".  So even if you have a group of say 10 finches that are coming

> and going from your yard/feeder - the advice is to count them "every time

> you see them that you, personally, can't say it is the same bird".

>   This advice is not just about birds in our backyards.  And Cornell

> doesn't consider it "over counting" (probably because you will also

> miss many birds that might visit your backyard when you do something

> as seemingly insignificant as just getting another cup of coffee).

>   There are similar considerations for 2 or more people all seeing and

> reporting the -same- bird ... perhaps even birding together.

>

>   So here is my take/interpretation of this advice.  As long as everyone is

> using pretty much the same methods - it doesn't matter ... because

> what the science is about is the changes - over time and even over

> relatively long periods of time.  Such as from one season to the next or

> one year to the next or one decade to the next.

>   We all know about events such as "irruptions" and "long term trends"

> etc.

>

>   ===> If we have lots of data (reports) then it all averages out in ways

>             that wouldn't be true for just a few reports (total number of

>             checklist).

>

>   But there -are- lots of checklists being done in all kinds of situations.

> So report what you can ID and let the citizen science work out what it

> means.  Even reports such as "Gull, species" are valuable/useful -

> especially when compared to no reports at all?

>

>              - Jim in Skagit

>

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